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Is the anyone that is missing anyparts to the carverfest amp

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angelod307

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Post Wed Nov 27, 2013 8:28 pm

Re: Is the anyone that is missing anyparts to the carverfest

Ones with the fuse, no go. Iec standard socket i have.
CarverFest: I just go for the arts and crafts
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Magnaryder

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Post Wed Nov 27, 2013 10:05 pm

Re: Is the anyone that is missing anyparts to the carverfest

angelod307 wrote:Ones with the fuse, no go. Iec standard socket i have.


I got one with the fuse but it doesn't fit the elongated slot...Beavis on/"he said slot" heheheheh

thanks anyway

ray
Magnaryder

Its going to be used equipment when I sell it, so it may as well be used equipment when I buy it.

Tim deParavicini's E.A.R. Yoshino V20 Integrated Amplifier, Fosgate Signature Phono pre, No. 50 and 51 Carverfest Tube amps, Hammond M3 tube amp, Ariston RD-40 Turntable w/ Linn Basik LSV tonearn, Grado Statement Master1 cartridge, Cardas Silver wire service and wire block, Carver TX-8 & 11 tuners, Carver TD-12 & 1700 decks, Tascam CC-222mkII CD recorder, Carver HR-742 reciever, DBX-3BX & 200xg & 120x, CarverAudio ALV prototypes, Alesis Studio One loudspeakers, Dahlquist DQ-8s, The Carver Research DarkStar Sub and Stax Earspeakers.

THIS SPACE FOR RENT...helping the blind to hear, one valve at a time
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stevek

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Post Thu Nov 28, 2013 8:12 am

Re: Is the anyone that is missing anyparts to the carverfest

radioeng2 wrote:Hi Martin,
If you're referring to installing some of the "full size" big iron from Edcor, forget it. First, it won't fit on the chassis. Second, it's not needed. Good iron for the EL84 is the Dynaco iron for the ST35 anyway. It'll cost you about what two of the amps cost us probably.
Mark


radioeng2,
Why do you say "it's not needed" ?

Martin1970 is talking about changing the XPP10-8-8K, with a frequency response of 70hz - 18khz, to another transformer with a frequency response of ~20hz-20khz. Are you saying that going from a 70hz-18khz OPT to a 20hz-20khz OPT would be inaudible?
Steve
Decware SE34I.3 (11/13), Carver M500t(8/12), Benchmark USB Preamp (10/10), Emerald Physics CS-2 (7/14), Sony CDP-CE505,
Sonos Zone Player ZP90 (9/11), Sonos Play:3(9/11), Sonos Bridge(9/11), Qnap TS-219P+ Music Server(9/11). Spares:
Sunfire CRM-2 (2010)
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radioeng2

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Post Thu Nov 28, 2013 8:16 am

Re: Is the anyone that is missing anyparts to the carverfest

Hey Ray,

Measure the opening that's cut in the chassis. I've got at least one or maybe two styles of inlet blocks with fuses. I think they're bigger, but lets check. If one happens to fit, I'll drop one to you. If not, I'll help watch for one that does fit.

Mark
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radioeng2

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Post Thu Nov 28, 2013 8:42 am

Re: Is the anyone that is missing anyparts to the carverfest

stevek wrote: radioeng2,
Why do you say "it's not needed" ?

Martin1970 is talking about changing the XPP10-8-8K, with a frequency response of 70hz - 18khz, to another transformer with a frequency response of ~20hz-20khz. Are you saying that going from a 70hz-18khz OPT to a 20hz-20khz OPT would be inaudible?
Steve

Good Morning Steve,

No, I wouldn't say inaudible in all cases. Just not much change in many uses. That's proven by all the different speakers these have been hooked up to, including professional reviewer systems, and no one has been sent running from lack of bottom end.

The little guys being spec'd at 70hz doesn't mean output goes away at that freq. It means as you go lower in freq and higher in output, that the core saturates quicker and distortion will rise as you push harder. So if you're running a reasonably eff speaker at sane levels, the change to a bigger transformer will have little effect on real listening. Little, not none.

Again, the right tool for the job is key. The single ended designs running single digit watts need very efficient speakers. These small PP ones need something somewhat reasonable. The big tube PP's can do about all but the real punishing load type speakers. But all those rule of thumbs are bendable depending on your usage. So guys listening without great loudness can get away with less reasonable speakers and do fine. Very low end distortion, real world usage, isn't our goal but as it starts to creap up in level is much less noticable than far less amounts up into the voice range. That's another reason it's not been a complaint up until being slammed with steady state insane level tones. Not music.

And in the case of these amps, going back and trying to retro on a fuller sized OT would be a big problem. So then you think about putting it on a new chassis WITH enough room and no cutouts that won't match? Well then you're just the cost of the power transformer away from building a new amp and leaving alone the original.

Steve I've got a whole slew of different EL84 amps around. Parts differences, voltage differences in them yield far more changes in sonics between them than just simply the output iron. While they'd all bench differently, the low end would hold up better on the bigger iron, but the other differences are a bigger deal and are more noticable than just low end distortion.

Mark
Last edited by radioeng2 on Thu Nov 28, 2013 8:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
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radioeng2

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Post Thu Nov 28, 2013 8:52 am

Re: Is the anyone that is missing anyparts to the carverfest

Also, 20hz to 20khz is a fantasy number. It's our target kind of thing. You'd be surprised how little flatness of response matters. Let alone the total bandwidth.

Amazing music can happen from a system without touching the extremes and the real world room alters any electronics flatness of response. That's not to say you don't target greater bandwidth in design as desirable. It's all a question of how the end result winds up as a listener carrying meaningful information and impact.

Idealism has to tempered with reality. If you don't strive for a balance between them, then you tend to wind up with a system you'd rather turn off and walk away from rather than play another album from. I place much greater value in being able to move Bob to the point of having tears on his face at the end of a song rather than any bench test number.

Mark

PS...sorry Angelo we managed to go so far of topic.
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frenchguy

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Post Thu Nov 28, 2013 9:59 am

Re: Is the anyone that is missing anyparts to the carverfest

" I place much greater value in being able to move Bob to the point of having tears on his face at the end of a song rather than any bench test number."


Well said Mark!! =D> =D> =D>
Carver M-4.0t & Rollandized tfm42, ct-6 & ct-17, sda390t, jolida jd 100A & JBL L96,s Modified JBL 4401,s W/Ribbon Tweeters, Carverfest vacuum tube amp & Dared SL-2000A tube preamp, Carver AL3 amazing speakers in natural oak & Douglas connection cables
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Zoot Horn

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Post Thu Nov 28, 2013 11:58 am

Re: Is the anyone that is missing anyparts to the carverfest

The tone man,, it is all about the tone. ,,,, enjoy
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tinpan

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Post Thu Nov 28, 2013 1:05 pm

Re: Is the anyone that is missing anyparts to the carverfest

I read that when you emailed me Rabbit. All I can say is, I've had no issues with low end on my speakers. I don't think anyone else did either that heard them.
Tinpan

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Magnaryder

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Post Thu Nov 28, 2013 4:30 pm

Re: Is the anyone that is missing anyparts to the carverfest

stevek wrote:
radioeng2 wrote:Hi Martin,
If you're referring to installing some of the "full size" big iron from Edcor, forget it. First, it won't fit on the chassis. Second, it's not needed. Good iron for the EL84 is the Dynaco iron for the ST35 anyway. It'll cost you about what two of the amps cost us probably.
Mark


radioeng2,
Why do you say "it's not needed" ?

Martin1970 is talking about changing the XPP10-8-8K, with a frequency response of 70hz - 18khz, to another transformer with a frequency response of ~20hz-20khz. Are you saying that going from a 70hz-18khz OPT to a 20hz-20khz OPT would be inaudible?
Steve


Steve I read the thread running on the other forum and noticed RobertR mentioned your system had so little bass while we were at the Fest. Why didn't you ask Bob and get Greg to put it on his gear there. Bet Bob could have answered any questions you had there in Bryson City.

ray
Magnaryder

Its going to be used equipment when I sell it, so it may as well be used equipment when I buy it.

Tim deParavicini's E.A.R. Yoshino V20 Integrated Amplifier, Fosgate Signature Phono pre, No. 50 and 51 Carverfest Tube amps, Hammond M3 tube amp, Ariston RD-40 Turntable w/ Linn Basik LSV tonearn, Grado Statement Master1 cartridge, Cardas Silver wire service and wire block, Carver TX-8 & 11 tuners, Carver TD-12 & 1700 decks, Tascam CC-222mkII CD recorder, Carver HR-742 reciever, DBX-3BX & 200xg & 120x, CarverAudio ALV prototypes, Alesis Studio One loudspeakers, Dahlquist DQ-8s, The Carver Research DarkStar Sub and Stax Earspeakers.

THIS SPACE FOR RENT...helping the blind to hear, one valve at a time
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stevek

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Post Fri Nov 29, 2013 12:01 am

Re: Is the anyone that is missing anyparts to the carverfest

Magnaryder wrote:Steve I read the thread running on the other forum and noticed RobertR mentioned your system had so little bass while we were at the Fest. Why didn't you ask Bob and get Greg to put it on his gear there. Bet Bob could have answered any questions you had there in Bryson City.
ray


Ray,
I didn't have a system at this years fest. Robert and I were playing music on the cabin's system out of our laptops. Robert meant that the songs on my playlists have very little bass. I have been listening to a lot of female vocals recently Easy Listening and Jazz etc.

I didn't hear anything off with the bass on the VTA 20, the bass sounded comparable to SS amps that I use in my system. This was true even after I saw the waveforms on the bench with distortion beginning at ~50hz, contrary to expectation bias. (even with hard rock and metal source material) So I agree with radioeng2's point although I would still like to hear/see an experiment upgrading one channel with an OPT with a larger core.
Steve
Decware SE34I.3 (11/13), Carver M500t(8/12), Benchmark USB Preamp (10/10), Emerald Physics CS-2 (7/14), Sony CDP-CE505,
Sonos Zone Player ZP90 (9/11), Sonos Play:3(9/11), Sonos Bridge(9/11), Qnap TS-219P+ Music Server(9/11). Spares:
Sunfire CRM-2 (2010)
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Magnaryder

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Post Fri Nov 29, 2013 1:57 am

Re: Is the anyone that is missing anyparts to the carverfest

stevek wrote:
Magnaryder wrote:Steve I read the thread running on the other forum and noticed RobertR mentioned your system had so little bass while we were at the Fest. Why didn't you ask Bob and get Greg to put it on his gear there. Bet Bob could have answered any questions you had there in Bryson City.
ray


Ray,
I didn't have a system at this years fest. Robert and I were playing music on the cabin's system out of our laptops. Robert meant that the songs on my playlists have very little bass. I have been listening to a lot of female vocals recently Easy Listening and Jazz etc.

I didn't hear anything off with the bass on the VTA 20, the bass sounded comparable to SS amps that I use in my system. This was true even after I saw the waveforms on the bench with distortion beginning at ~50hz, contrary to expectation bias. (even with hard rock and metal source material) So I agree with radioeng2's point although I would still like to hear/see an experiment upgrading one channel with an OPT with a larger core.
Steve


Brother I can dig it. My mother gave me my father's record collection and I'm rediscovering Nancy Wilson, Ella Fitzgerald, Laney Kazan Anita Wilson and others. I will admit I've been to Edcor's web page to price 'other' OPT iron But after reading Mark's response I'm not certain it would be worth the dosh considering what I've already gained and what we're hearing here in sunny Bucyrus. Fresh out of the box a pair of bridged CF amps blew a big Cary amp out of the water. I can tell you the Cary owner was shocked. He made the call. That's how good they sound. I've modded just about everything you can on a CF amp but it doesn't change the fact that these little guys are really musical from the start. I heard them on Angelo's Cinema Ribbons and I thought they sounded fine. With only 20 watts the Cinema Ribbon don't have the power they need to be really dynamic, but like I said, they didn't sound too bad.


I haven't heard a production VTA 20. I only have my CF amps to reference anything I observed. Maybe next CarverFest. I'm holding out for a phono pre or simple line-pre project that matches our CF amps. That would be way kewl.

ray
Magnaryder

Its going to be used equipment when I sell it, so it may as well be used equipment when I buy it.

Tim deParavicini's E.A.R. Yoshino V20 Integrated Amplifier, Fosgate Signature Phono pre, No. 50 and 51 Carverfest Tube amps, Hammond M3 tube amp, Ariston RD-40 Turntable w/ Linn Basik LSV tonearn, Grado Statement Master1 cartridge, Cardas Silver wire service and wire block, Carver TX-8 & 11 tuners, Carver TD-12 & 1700 decks, Tascam CC-222mkII CD recorder, Carver HR-742 reciever, DBX-3BX & 200xg & 120x, CarverAudio ALV prototypes, Alesis Studio One loudspeakers, Dahlquist DQ-8s, The Carver Research DarkStar Sub and Stax Earspeakers.

THIS SPACE FOR RENT...helping the blind to hear, one valve at a time
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stevek

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Post Fri Nov 29, 2013 7:52 am

Re: Is the anyone that is missing anyparts to the carverfest

Magnaryder wrote:I haven't heard a production VTA 20. I only have my CF amps to reference anything I observed. Maybe next CarverFest. I'm holding out for a phono pre or simple line-pre project that matches our CF amps. That would be way kewl.
ray


Ray,
I like my SS amp better than the VTA 20 so I sold the VTA. I also didn't want to take a pristine VTA 20 and hack it up to fit a different OPT.

I didn't think that the VTA 20 sounded as good as the Carverfest amp I heard at the fest, so I was a bit disappointed. Of course at the time I didn't realize that George had upgraded components in his amp. So I wasn't hearing a 'stock' Carverfest amp.
Steve
Decware SE34I.3 (11/13), Carver M500t(8/12), Benchmark USB Preamp (10/10), Emerald Physics CS-2 (7/14), Sony CDP-CE505,
Sonos Zone Player ZP90 (9/11), Sonos Play:3(9/11), Sonos Bridge(9/11), Qnap TS-219P+ Music Server(9/11). Spares:
Sunfire CRM-2 (2010)
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radioeng2

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Post Fri Nov 29, 2013 8:54 am

Re: Is the anyone that is missing anyparts to the carverfest

Magnaryder wrote: I haven't heard a production VTA 20.

Ray,

Actually you have heard production VTA20's if you made it up and heard Eric's running the baby Dahlquest this year.

Well....he's rolled tubes and used nice wires etc. And had the sun coming thru the windows. None of which will have changed bench numbers, just made it sound nicer. S-w-e-e-t little rig all except for that horribly distorted bass. :^o

Mark

PS...Steve, no doubt some nice iron would be a bit detectable in comparing to stock. Listening is a powerful tool! Might have to convert your listening habits to that new form of music, easy listening-jazz-rap to tell though... :-& :shock:
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Magnaryder

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Post Fri Nov 29, 2013 6:25 pm

Re: Is the anyone that is missing anyparts to the carverfest

radioeng2 wrote:
Magnaryder wrote: I haven't heard a production VTA 20.

Ray,

Actually you have heard production VTA20's if you made it up and heard Eric's running the baby Dahlquest this year.


Well....he's rolled tubes and used nice wires etc. And had the sun coming thru the windows. None of which will have changed bench numbers, just made it sound nicer. S-w-e-e-t little rig all except for that horribly distorted bass. :^o

Mark
PS...Steve, no doubt some nice iron would be a bit detectable in comparing to stock. Listening is a powerful tool! Might have to convert your listening habits to that new form of music, easy listening-jazz-rap to tell though... :-& :shock:

I don't think I got up there. At least not that I remember...I was on vacation afterall

ray
Magnaryder

Its going to be used equipment when I sell it, so it may as well be used equipment when I buy it.

Tim deParavicini's E.A.R. Yoshino V20 Integrated Amplifier, Fosgate Signature Phono pre, No. 50 and 51 Carverfest Tube amps, Hammond M3 tube amp, Ariston RD-40 Turntable w/ Linn Basik LSV tonearn, Grado Statement Master1 cartridge, Cardas Silver wire service and wire block, Carver TX-8 & 11 tuners, Carver TD-12 & 1700 decks, Tascam CC-222mkII CD recorder, Carver HR-742 reciever, DBX-3BX & 200xg & 120x, CarverAudio ALV prototypes, Alesis Studio One loudspeakers, Dahlquist DQ-8s, The Carver Research DarkStar Sub and Stax Earspeakers.

THIS SPACE FOR RENT...helping the blind to hear, one valve at a time
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