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It is currently Tue Sep 02, 2014 1:51 pm

About horns

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tinpan

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TFM-45

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Joined: Tue Jan 05, 2010 7:48 am

Location: Spotsylvania, VA

Post Sat Apr 26, 2014 6:48 am

Re: About horns

Ok, so we've seen a couple of the compression driver horn set ups withe 808, 288 and 299 horn drivers. One other nice advantage to those is if you blow a driver you just have to replace a diaphragm and they run about $100 a pop.

Moving on my other set up I like are the full range drivers, these are Lowther PM4a drivers. Running in full range mode, with the right cabinet, they can go to 30hz but usually you'll get them down to about 50hz. They are an 8 inch paper cone and a 30 ln magnet. The downside to these are the cost, they run about $3k a pair. In our little auto comparison think of them as the Bentley of this group, a nice stodgy British technology that has been around and hasn't changed since the 50's

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I am crossing these over at 250Hz, everything above 250 goes through the horn, everything below goes through the ElectroVoice Sentry IV bass bins. These bass bins are another bass reflex design using a pair of 12 inch EV drivers. One of the questions we had was to see how it compared to a single 15 inch driver on the Altec 828 bass bins.

One other big consideration that I haven't mentioned is the curve of the bell of the horn. Klipsch uses a Tractrix design, Altec uses an exponential design and these Azura horns use a Le Cleche design. You could have pages of discussion just on what horn technology is the best but for me, I really like the Le Cleche. It doesn't look like it should but it really focuses the imaging spot on. On well recorded albums the vocals are dead center in the middle.

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I finally removed the extra amp and other pair of speakers and I like the less cluttered look of this wall now. If I could only find a way to hide the Lascalas now.


Here's a little fun from last night, as you can see I'm really not playing this loud but you can feel the music vibrating in the arms of the chair without using a sub to make the floor thump. I was really surprised how well this album is recorded. Usually rock stuff doesn't sound good on these.


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Here's another direction you can go, I have some stuff listed on CL and one of the local audio dudes offered this for sale to me. It's the Azura horn with the TangBand W8-1772 drivers and Fostex T90A tweeters. He's using a Marchand XM-9 for the crossover and JBL 2242H drivers in JBL ported bass bins

The Azura horns go for $600 a pair
The TangBands go for $450 a pair
The Fostex go for $400 a pair
the Marchand $400 to $500 used
JBL bass bins a couple hundred bucks
JBL 18inch drivers about $1200 a pair

If you are in the DC area, this guy is selling the horns, Tangband and Fostex drivers for $1,000 which is a pretty good deal. You would just need to add a crossover and bass bins and you would have a killer horn set up for any of the EL 84, KT88 or KT120 based tube amps from Carver. If I wasn't down sizing I'd be all over these.

Gotta run
Tinpan

HT - Sunfire TG IV, Sunfire Cinema Grand Sig. 400 x 5, Oppo 93, Klipsch LaScala (3), Cornwalls (2), SW-12, Sony 60" LCD

2 channel - AN L2 Pre-amp, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN 2.1 DAC, Oppo DV-981HD, Lowther PM4a/Azurahorn/SentryIV

2 channel - AN L3 Signature Line stage, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN Sig. DAC 3.1 , AN Sig. Phono Stage, Sota Comet TT, Altec A5's

2 channel - empty, Klipschorns

2 channel - Audio Note Kit 1 300b SET, Audio Note DAC 2.1, Altec A4's
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tinpan

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TFM-45

Posts: 577

Joined: Tue Jan 05, 2010 7:48 am

Location: Spotsylvania, VA

Post Tue Apr 29, 2014 3:08 pm

Re: About horns

Here are some smaller horn set ups that won't break the bank and are quite nice if you don't have a lot of room.

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Here's an AH horn, it's a conical shape and really projects the sound forward, it also gives a very focused s.w.33t spot. They go for about $1300 new.

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I'm using a BC driver available from parts express for around $250 a pair. These are a nice new modern sonically similar to the Altec 808 1 inch drivers.


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I have the same driver on this Eleven horn. These horns use a Le Cleche curve and go for around $1,200 new. I love absolutely love this horn. It images like the Azura's

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Here you can see the Eleven horns mounted on a pair of Parts Express bass bins. The bass bins use 2" kappalite neo LF drivers, internal 1500Hz 2nd order crossover wired with 47 labs wire and obligatto oil caps. While small they do sound very cool.

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The AH horns are teamed with my Frazier Dixielander bass bins. These are a small bass reflex speaker with a 10inch woofer, I think it's similar to a University speaker. The sound is quite nice especially for a small horn set up.



As fun as these are, I am downsizing so these will be hitting cl locally here over the next few weeks. They were fun projects though
Tinpan

HT - Sunfire TG IV, Sunfire Cinema Grand Sig. 400 x 5, Oppo 93, Klipsch LaScala (3), Cornwalls (2), SW-12, Sony 60" LCD

2 channel - AN L2 Pre-amp, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN 2.1 DAC, Oppo DV-981HD, Lowther PM4a/Azurahorn/SentryIV

2 channel - AN L3 Signature Line stage, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN Sig. DAC 3.1 , AN Sig. Phono Stage, Sota Comet TT, Altec A5's

2 channel - empty, Klipschorns

2 channel - Audio Note Kit 1 300b SET, Audio Note DAC 2.1, Altec A4's
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tinpan

User avatar

TFM-45

Posts: 577

Joined: Tue Jan 05, 2010 7:48 am

Location: Spotsylvania, VA

Post Thu May 22, 2014 7:41 am

Re: About horns

A couple more posts to complete the series. I have a couple buddies and we all pretty much think the perfect sound to us is a HiFi compression driver like the Altec 288 driver and a 15" bass driver running in a two way set up. In addition to the Altec configs, one can always play around. Here are a couple different Altec drivers in this horn set up

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The bass bins are JBL cabinets with 15" eminence kappalite neo LF drivers, anAltec N 500 C crossover networks inside, all original parts, but completely rewired with 47 Labs wire inside crossover and going to woofers.

The Horns are a Jabo with Altec 288 - 8k drivers and Jabo milled aluminum horn adaptors (to allow for 288). Cocobolo horn stands with points. One thing I don't like about these horns is they really focus the sw33t spot. The sw33t spot is only about a foot wide, course I have a buddy that likes that feature about them.

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This config uses the 288-8k which is the ferrite driver and the magnet weighs 30 lbs

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The 288-8k is 109db efficient and rated for 15 watts. The frequency response is 500-15,000 Hz

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The other driver you can use is the Altec 288C. This one uses a 20 lb Alnico magnet and the original specs are 500 to 16,000 Hz. It's rated for 40 watts and is 109 db efficient. This one has had new diaphragms installed from Great Plains Audio ( This pair). Most people tend to go for the Alnico version but expect to pay a premium for them since they are hard to find.

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Much as I hate to I am thinking about thinning the heard and moving these one to their next owners. Really debating on these though, They do sound nice.

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Here's a wide shot of them. I have pretty much settled down to 4 systems that I use when I want to listen to music. They are as follows:

Garage - 300b Tube amp and Altec A4's

Front room - 300b tube amp Altec A5's

Front room - 3000b tube amp and Lowther PM4a set up

Front room - Sunfire TGIV with Sunfire 400 x 5 Cinema Grand amp with Klipsch Lascalas and Conrwalls. Although I haven't written much about this set up, I love the way it sounds. I've had both the 600 x 2 and the 400 x 5 and I love the way both of them sound driving Klipsch Heritage speakers...Hmmm....also horn set ups.

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These are JBL 4320's and they are on my bucket list to try. I have heard they are very similar to the ALtec A5 in sounding, while different, very good. They don't take up as much room as and A5. They are very hard to find and the sw.33t spot price for these is $1,500+- .
Tinpan

HT - Sunfire TG IV, Sunfire Cinema Grand Sig. 400 x 5, Oppo 93, Klipsch LaScala (3), Cornwalls (2), SW-12, Sony 60" LCD

2 channel - AN L2 Pre-amp, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN 2.1 DAC, Oppo DV-981HD, Lowther PM4a/Azurahorn/SentryIV

2 channel - AN L3 Signature Line stage, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN Sig. DAC 3.1 , AN Sig. Phono Stage, Sota Comet TT, Altec A5's

2 channel - empty, Klipschorns

2 channel - Audio Note Kit 1 300b SET, Audio Note DAC 2.1, Altec A4's
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radioeng2

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Post Thu May 22, 2014 9:31 am

Re: About horns

I don't know how you think you'll do on Craigslist. But if you worked it in advance a little and packed 'em up and brought 'em over to CarverFest, I'd just about bet you could sell them. I have a bunch of buddies that would drool over all of them!

You've got some really nice stuff there! I'd love to hear them as they sit!! I've got several horns around but find myself really happy with OB and set up the horns, listen a bit, and take them back down in favor of the OB. I've got a pair of Oris...which I've run with several different drivers. I have a nice pair of the EV Sentry 3 and then I have a pair of the ....(name escapes me...the multi-driver point source that comes from the pro side). I have several friends with LeCleach, several others with large format 150/200/500hz style. A buddy with some very nicely reworked A-7's. So on and so forth.

So if you're serious about selling some, I'd wonder if you'd better with some of them rather than the CL avenue.... Be glad to help hook you up with some of those guys if you think it'd be beneficial.

Mark
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radioeng2

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Post Thu May 22, 2014 12:16 pm

Re: About horns

Unity Horns from Sound Physics Lab. That's who I was trying to think of...from Danley.
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tinpan

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TFM-45

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Joined: Tue Jan 05, 2010 7:48 am

Location: Spotsylvania, VA

Post Thu May 22, 2014 3:36 pm

Re: About horns

Sounds like you have some nice horn set ups as well. Roscoe, one of the local DIYer's had an open baffle set up with a co ax speaker that was awesome. It was like an Altec 604 but it had blue foam on the end of the horn. It sounded unbelievable. That was the first time I heard Louis Armstrong's ST James Infirmary and i couldn't pick my jaw off the floor. It was the best sound I ever heard.

He was using a home made current source amp, two pieces of plywood and those drivers, wish i could remember the name of them.

I'd love to hear a Sentry III someday they look very cool.

I've been doing alright on CL around here. I've moved several pairs of Klipsch speakers and some extra Altec gear so far. I'm not in any hurry so if it moves great, if not, that's fine too. So far i've only listed 2 of the horn systems and I've had pretty good activity on those, I don't think they'll be around very long.
Tinpan

HT - Sunfire TG IV, Sunfire Cinema Grand Sig. 400 x 5, Oppo 93, Klipsch LaScala (3), Cornwalls (2), SW-12, Sony 60" LCD

2 channel - AN L2 Pre-amp, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN 2.1 DAC, Oppo DV-981HD, Lowther PM4a/Azurahorn/SentryIV

2 channel - AN L3 Signature Line stage, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN Sig. DAC 3.1 , AN Sig. Phono Stage, Sota Comet TT, Altec A5's

2 channel - empty, Klipschorns

2 channel - Audio Note Kit 1 300b SET, Audio Note DAC 2.1, Altec A4's
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fill35U

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Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2014 8:45 am

Location: East Virginia

Post Sat May 24, 2014 9:24 am

Re: About horns

Thanks for the very detailed writeup and all the pics, Tinpan! \:D/

I think I liked your Jabo/JBL setup the best. But those Eleven horns are astounding! If it would work out, I'd really like to hear the Elevens on those JBL bins.

The good thing about Craigslist is that it gives you the chance to meet local people with the same interest, and who might have gear to trade. Glad you're having good luck!
Current setup: Random Naked Amps Piled on Floor and/or Wedged Into Shelves

Don't call amp mutilators "butchers"- butchers are highly skilled professionals.
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angelod307

SILVER-7 TUBE AMP

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Post Sat May 24, 2014 11:38 am

Re: About horns

My wife tell me often how horny I am, but you sir.....are the hornist man I know. Well done, I envy ya a little .
CarverFest: I just go for the arts and crafts
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TNRabbit

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Post Mon May 26, 2014 12:06 pm

Re: About horns

These are about my favorite of all your bunch:

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TNRabbit
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From FrankieD's lips to your ears: Sunfire - a quiet box of endless power.

Sunfire TG-IV/400~7 Amp
Carver SD/A-360 CDP
Benchmark DAC-1
Sony SACD/DVD-A
Active bi-amp: Ashly XR-1001 & 2 Rane PEQ-15s
Main: HotRodded AL-IIIs
Sub: Klipsch RT-12d
Center: Sunfire CRS-3c
Surround: Sunfire CRS-3 (x 2)

OconeeOrange wrote:"Gary likes to play it 'loud' as do I. His system begs you turn it up until you die"

RIP WIlliam B. Dibble, 1948-2012. I'll miss you my friend.
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tinpan

User avatar

TFM-45

Posts: 577

Joined: Tue Jan 05, 2010 7:48 am

Location: Spotsylvania, VA

Post Thu May 29, 2014 8:25 am

Re: About horns

Those Elevens would be a little under powered. The BC driver is just too small. You could go to a larger Eleven horn and a 288 driver. That would be a hot set up with the le cleche horn.

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All set up for a guy stopping by at 10 am today. He'll probably pick up one of these pair


I sent him this last night on email and he wanted to be over here first thing...lol.

The JBL will probably be gone Saturday. The original owner is dying because I put them on CL. I'm pretty sure he'll be picking them up and his home-brew 300b

I have the walnut bass bins and the AH horns sold next week, unless today's guy picks them up.

In a flash they will be gone...I must admit it is hard letting go ...

I must remain focused. My new adventure will be automobile audio systems. That's really the only area I haven't really explored yet.
Tinpan

HT - Sunfire TG IV, Sunfire Cinema Grand Sig. 400 x 5, Oppo 93, Klipsch LaScala (3), Cornwalls (2), SW-12, Sony 60" LCD

2 channel - AN L2 Pre-amp, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN 2.1 DAC, Oppo DV-981HD, Lowther PM4a/Azurahorn/SentryIV

2 channel - AN L3 Signature Line stage, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN Sig. DAC 3.1 , AN Sig. Phono Stage, Sota Comet TT, Altec A5's

2 channel - empty, Klipschorns

2 channel - Audio Note Kit 1 300b SET, Audio Note DAC 2.1, Altec A4's
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radioeng2

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Location: E TN

Post Thu May 29, 2014 12:50 pm

Re: About horns

I didn't know selling something was an option! :-"
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hewlew1

"You Fuckin' Fucks"

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Post Thu May 29, 2014 7:47 pm

Re: About horns

A truly dedicated hoarder never sells period!
"Carver Audio, why settle for less, just ask my neighbors"
C1,C2,CT3,CT6,CT7/3,CT23,CT26,C4000,The Receiver,M500,M500T/6,M1.5T,TFM24/2,TFM/25/2,TFM35,TFM35X,TFM/42,DTL200,TDR1700,DPL20,TX11,5.2Center,5.1Sub/3,Original Amazings,Platinum Amazings/2,AL3'S,Polk SDA SRS, Polk SDA 1C's, Polk RTA11's, Polk Monitor 10's,Monitor 7's, Sunfire 300x2 /5, Sunfire pre, Sunfire MK2 Sub, 4 Carverfest monoblocks, Mapletree Audio Designs Tube Preamp,Phase Linear Andromeda III speakers, Phase Linear 4000 Preamp, Dahlquist DQ-10's
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I don't kiss ass and I dont take peoples shit, so dont expect it from me!
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tinpan

User avatar

TFM-45

Posts: 577

Joined: Tue Jan 05, 2010 7:48 am

Location: Spotsylvania, VA

Post Fri May 30, 2014 10:34 am

Re: About horns

I must remain focused. My new adventure will be automobile audio systems

Oh I'm not done hoarding, just chafing directions...lol.

The walnut bass bins and the Jeffery Jackson horns are gone now.
Tinpan

HT - Sunfire TG IV, Sunfire Cinema Grand Sig. 400 x 5, Oppo 93, Klipsch LaScala (3), Cornwalls (2), SW-12, Sony 60" LCD

2 channel - AN L2 Pre-amp, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN 2.1 DAC, Oppo DV-981HD, Lowther PM4a/Azurahorn/SentryIV

2 channel - AN L3 Signature Line stage, AN Interstage Mono Blocks 300b PSE, AN Sig. DAC 3.1 , AN Sig. Phono Stage, Sota Comet TT, Altec A5's

2 channel - empty, Klipschorns

2 channel - Audio Note Kit 1 300b SET, Audio Note DAC 2.1, Altec A4's
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